Moms On Issues
with Sara and Veronica
We're two moms with different backgrounds, jobs and points of view, writing about our opinions on the political and social issues affecting working moms. We'll also keep our eye on the media and the celebrity mom world to highlight issues that are relevant to your life.
Check out our personal blogs: Veronica's Blog and Sara's Blog
It was the tweet heard around the world. Sarah Palin is John McCain’s pick for his running mate. Ah, sweet irony.
Palin is now the second woman to ever be chosen for the vice-presidential position on a major party ticket. This is a major milestone for women in this country. It was a generation ago, 1984, that Geraldine Ferraro was the running mate for Walter Mondale. The college students I work with on a daily basis weren’t even born then. Think about that.
That said, I think that Palin may be the best thing for feminism since Alice Paul went on a hunger strike. Stay with me…
It is obvious to many women that the decision to pick Palin is a direct ploy to woo still angry Hillary Rodham Clinton supporters. For some of those HRC supporters McCain is far too conservative for them to really vote for and the addition of a NRA-supporting, abstinence-only toting, polar bear-hating woman to the ticket isn’t going to sway them. Yet, the GOP is playing Palin as if she is the answer to disgruntled feminists.
In Palin’s address at McCain’s announcement that she would be his running mate she uses these key feminist phrases:
• “I’ve stood up to the old politics as usual, to the special interests, to the lobbyists, the Big Oil companies and the ‘good old boy’ network.” Feminists are often talking about how best to either dismantle the “good old boy” network or create one of our own to push, nurture, and mentor young women to powerful positions.
• “…it’s fitting that this trust has been given to me 88 years almost to the day after the women of America first gained the right to vote.” Reminding all women that in 88 years of women having the right to vote only two women have ever been a running mate on a major national ticket for the White House.
• “It was rightly noted in Denver this week that Hillary left 18 million cracks in the highest, hardest glass ceiling in America. But it turns out the women of America aren’t finished yet, and we can shatter that glass ceiling once and for all.” This plays right into the McCain ads that question why Obama didn’t choose Hillary for Veep. A sharp reminder of the sexism that Hillary supporters are still fuming about. It’s a thinly veiled message to women everywhere, “See, we’re not as sexist as those Democrats! We chose a woman!”
I have already heard from friends who say that mothers, grandmothers, and other women in their lives are saying things like “But she’s a woman, she can’t be sexist!” or “But she’s with Feminists for Life! I should vote for feminists right?” Never has it been more advantageous to call yourself a feminist in the political sphere.
Obama has spent a fair amount of time (but ya need to spend even more, Senator!) trying to convince women that he will be their advocate. McCain has Carly Fiorina leading his Women for McCain campaign. But as I’ve heard in other conversations, we should always turn that phrase around, no matter who the candidate and ask, “Is it McCain/Obama/Palin for Women?”
And this is where the debate on what is feminism, who is a feminist, and what a feminist candidate really looks like it will enter the public discourse. Yes, I believe that Palin being on the GOP ticket will bring this country to a national conversation around kitchen tables, at the coffee shop, before staff meetings about what it means to be a feminist.
Feminism according to the Merriam-Webster’s dictionary is defined as, “the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes; organized activity on behalf of women’s rights and interests.” Does Governor Palin exhibit this definition?
• Palin is a lifetime member of the NRA: I know plenty of gun-toting feminists, but they differ from the NRA in that they believe in sensible gun laws. The NRA time and again lobbies against the assault weapon ban which most Americans support. Guns for hunting and self-protection are debatable among feminists, but I would never say all feminists are anti-gun.
• Palin believes we should teach creationism in school: Again, I know plenty of church going feminists who find solace in Jesus each and every single day. Yet, they also subscribe to the idea of separation of church and state and never, ever try to push their beliefs on others. They would also never use their opposable thumb on their nose and scoff at teaching a tried and true theory called evolution.
• Palin believes in teaching abstinence-only until marriage: This has to be one of the most dangerous laws we as a society have ever allowed to pass. First, teaching AOUM leaves out all medical fact that condoms can save our children from getting a sexually transmitted disease or infection including HIV. It leaves out vital facts from young women about not getting pregnant. We live in a sexualized society where everything is sex, sex, sex…It is our responsibility as parents and human beings to educate our children on what sex really is, how to have loving sex, and how to enjoy sex. Yes, I said we need to teach our children how to enjoy sex. I hope everyone reading this enjoys the sex they are having, so why not teach our children that sex is best left to having in a loving & safe relationship where both parties will get the most enjoyment as possible? Not to mention that AOUM doesn’t work.
• Palin is a member of Feminists for Life: Their major claim is that abortion gets men off the hook. I can understand that. But by removing the choice from women to carry a pregnancy to term or not, not only keeps the men on the hook, but also keeps the women on the hook. Maybe women who have abortions are trying to reclaim their own lives and could give two hoots about the men? Palin even opposes abortion to save the life of a woman and in cases of rape and incest. Think about that again, Vice-President Palin would work to ensure that 12-year-old girls who were raped & impregnated by a family member would have to carry that pregnancy to term, give birth, and raise that child.
• Palin has joined forces with a man, McCain, who believes that women just need more job training to have equal pay. Who voted against strengthening the Violence Against Women Act even when the amendment was attached to a “pro-life” bill, the Unborn Victims of Violence Act. Note that link is to a PDF document, please refer to pages 6 and 10.
The GOP has rarely shown me any evidence that they want to create a society where women are free to make their own decisions, earn what they deserve, and have the support of a country that claims to have family values. Governor Palin fits that mold even with her beauty, smarts, five children, and uterus.
Just because she has to sit to pee, calls herself a feminist doesn’t mean she is one.
Feminists work to ensure that women and girls have access to equal education, have agency in their health decisions, are respected whether or not they give birth, and ultimately trust women to do what is right for them. Palin & the GOP do not trust women…They only trust women who can stand up and say, “Vote for me so I can tell you want to do with your life.” The Pink Elephants give a great break down of things Palin has done for Alaska, but none related to moving women forward towards equality.
What does a feminist candidate look like to you? What does feminism mean to you? I’ve met plenty of feminists who call themselves Republicans, but they usually differ from me on business issues. Some are even endorsed by feminist organizations. Are you one? How do you reconcile the tension between feminism and the goals of the Republican Party?
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[...] Veronica Arreola’s blog on “Why Sarah Palin is good for feminism”, excerpted here: This is where the debate on what is feminism, who is a feminist, and what a [...]
Why Sarah Palin is Good for Feminism - Majority Post | September 2nd, 2008 at 12:24 pm
Amen! I am a lifelong Democrat who supported Hillary. A woman in her 40’s looking to have children and a child of a mother who had me at age 43 (after 11 children) who is NOW TODAY declaring my support for PALIN!!!
I am sickend by Obama supporters and bloggers rudely citing how Palin’s’ child was a mistake??? Do you believe all children who have a disability are a mistake??? WOW. This is really scary rhetoric from someone who flaunts change and who must believe killing a child due to a disability is the right thing to do?
I am also changing my affiliation today because the Dems (my soon to be old party) are stating that a 17 year old girl having a child is a mistake. Wasn’t your candidate born to a teenage mother, too?
The fact that they would rather abort a child, consider themselves Pro-Choice (unless you choose to have that child, then you should abort a child and there is no choice), is disgusting.
So thank you all you Dems out there for stirring me down the path from supporting Hillary to now Palin. A mother, governor, strong outdoors woman, sportsman, maverick and by far more than any of you can say - a woman who believes in FAMILY.
Heidi (Tacoma, Washington)
Go PALIN!!!!
Heidi | September 2nd, 2008 at 12:29 pm
Women Want Safety, not Biden’s Abuse of Power
Senator Joe Biden was regularly and severely beaten by his older sister as a child and as an adolescent. How do we know this? He told us during a Senate hearing in 1990. http://www.ifeminists.net/introduction/editorials/2006/0503roberts.html
This is the same sister that raised his two sons after his wife and daughter were killed in an auto accident.
Biden has often claimed that the Violence against Women Act is the greatest achievement of his career. He also claims that a woman cannot be a perpetrator of domestic violence, despite the fact that hundreds of studies show that women commit acts of domestic violence as often or more often than men. Many studies also show that lesbian women physically attack their intimate partners at higher rates than heterosexual men.
As a result of Biden’s Violence against Women Act, the federal government pays states to create laws effectively requiring that innocent men be removed from their homes and families without even an allegation of violence, with no legitimate standards of evidence, when a woman makes a claim that she is afraid.
Elaine Epstein, president of the Massachusetts Bar Association (1999), has said “the facts have become irrelevant… restraining orders are granted to virtually all who apply. Regarding divorce cases, she states “allegations of abuse are now used for tactical advantage”. According to Epstein, who is also a former president of the Massachusetts Women’s Bar Association, restraining orders are doled out “like candy” and “in virtually all cases, no notice, meaningful hearing, or impartial weighing of evidence is to be had.” Cathy Young reports on the Elaine Epstein quote and the broader issue at Salon.com here:
http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/1999/10/25/restraining_orders/
State restraining order laws are starting to fall because they’re unconstitutional. The federal law behind them, written by Joe Biden, is likely to fall as well, not because it isn’t popular, but because it is clearly unconstitutional.
HumanRights101 | September 2nd, 2008 at 12:34 pm
NJ DV Law Overturned Amid Epidemic of False Allegations
New Jersey’s domestic violence statute has recently been found unconstitutional. The New Jersey Attorney General is taking this case to the state’s Supreme Court.
The New Jersey Law Journal reports that Judge Richard Russell of Ocean City made the following remarks on tape during a judicial training session regarding the issuance of restraining orders.
(source – scan of print copy: http://www.fathersandhusbands.org/NJ_Rights_1.pdf)
“If I had one message to give you today, it is that your job is not to weigh the parties’ rights as you might be inclined to do as having been private practitioners. Your job is not to become concerned about all the constitutional rights of the man that you’re violating as you grant a restraining order. Throw him out on the street, give him the clothes on his back and tell him, ‘See ya’ around.’ “
A new municipal judge attending the training session stated “The statute says we should apply just cause in issuing the order.” “You seem to be saying to grant every order.” Russell quickly replied, “Yeah, that’s what I seem to be saying.”
The article is full of comments from Russell and his colleagues that are equally inflammatory.
Perhaps you think Russell should have been disbarred for instructing judges to ignore the constitution. In doing so, he violated his greatest responsibility as a judge in the most blatant way possible. Perhaps you think he should have gone to prison.
Russell now serves on the New Jersey Supreme Court’s State Domestic Violence Working Group, the Executive Committee of the State Bar’s Family Law Section, and the New Jersey Supreme Court’s Family Practice Committee. He currently is the chair of the court’s Child Support Subcommittee.
Given a recent ruling declaring New Jersey’s domestic violence statute unconstitutional and given the imminent Supreme Court challenge, the truth regarding the real practices that are being used to separate men from their children and their homes must be heard.
HumanRights101 | September 2nd, 2008 at 12:35 pm
Well, I don’t agree with many of your comments, and some of them are plain inaccurate/incomplete, but I will focus on the question at hand.
To me, the word “feminism” makes me shudder because of the negative connotations attached to it. The fact that “feminism” to many means nearly limitless abortion “rights” frankly sickens me. I totally oppose the view that the way to empower women is to compromise the most wonderful power that we are born with. (If you don’t think the power to create and nourish life is wonderful, I feel sorry for you.) I feel that view has harmed women by making it look like a mother is something less than a complete human being. And that to be “as good as” a man, we must first cut off what makes us women. Feminism “should” be about celebrating what makes us women - womb and all.
It follows that “feminism” should be concerned with optimising the lives of all women, most of whom choose to raise children and hence are not impacted by the “feminists’” efforts with respect to abortion rights. Let’s take working moms, for example. What good does it do us to jump up and down and scream for abortion rights? We go back to work the next day and still make less than men (no improvement there since Roe v. Wade), and still struggle to find acceptable, affordable childcare options, and still bear judgment from both men and women (yeah, even working women) regarding our decision or need to work. How do “abortion rights” help us with this? All they are to us is a distraction.
Abortion rights often (usually?) mean the right for parents, partners, friends, co-workers, and even total strangers (”counselors”) to brow-beat women into having an abortion they don’t want. To kill what they feel to be precious and amazing. If abortion were not legal, or at least not strongly recommended by “counselors” who are trained to believe unplanned children are a scourge on both the individual and humanity, then the question for pregnant women would be whether to raise the child or relinquish it to another family to raise. Personally, I feel that the choice to delay one-on-one dating, the choice to abstain, the choice to use birth control, and the choice to relinquish are enough choices to preserve a woman’s rights without giving destructive rights to men. Abortion “rights” are a tool for men (and others) to abuse women. Even your example of a 12-year-old incest victim highlights the fact that abortion “rights” enable a man to do this to a child and get off with no repercussions simply by taking her to an abortion clinic and ordering her to keep his crime a secret. A publicly-discovered pregnancy would be more of a deterrant to would-be child rapists.
Further, I don’t see how “feminism” is connected with gun rights, educational curricula, etc. Both men and women have different views on these topics. With the exception of preserving constitutional protections, I wouldn’t vote based on those issues anyway.
In the mainstream concept of feminism, apparently a woman with conservative views is an outcast. Hence “feminism” will never be relevant to women as a group. If you consider that unfortunate, consider rethinking what “feminism” should mean to “feminists.”
The reason why Palin is good for feminists is that she highlights the fact that many, many intelligent women don’t agree with the “feminist” platform.
SKL | September 2nd, 2008 at 1:07 pm
I think those commenters above read a completely different piece than I did.
Nice job, Veronica.
Kim/hormone-colored days | September 2nd, 2008 at 1:29 pm
Reading your post and the comments, I have to say I agree…with Kim’s comment.\
I think you’ve presented a balanced view of feminism that tries to establish that it’s not a concept based on a single issue. Thanks for a thoughtful post.
Florinda | September 2nd, 2008 at 2:53 pm
We’re talking about Palin’s views on sex ed. over at the CA NOW blog: http://www.canow.org/canoworg/2008/09/sarah-palin-and.html
Elena Perez | September 2nd, 2008 at 3:00 pm
You know, I’d advise McCain-voting women who are mad at the Dems to look at McCain’s own rank sexism. Hello–he didn’t say boo when one of the good old boys in the GOP formed “Citizens United Not Timid” (GEDDIT?? HUR HUR HUR). What–it’s only bad when the Dems do it?
As far as abortion goes, anyone who thinks that feminism is about abortion only (and that those of us who have had them were forced) is woefully ignorant. Certainly, there are plenty of women and girls who were forced/pressured into having children they didn’t want, or giving up their babies for adoption. Oddly enough, we don’t hear about “post adoption syndrome” or hear about how the adoption industry victimizes women.
It’s quite telling how the government is evil and individual rights are paramount, until it comes to the lives and rights of women.
Sheelzebub | September 2nd, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Oh, and SKL–forcing a 12-year-old incest victim to carry a pregnancy to term is beyond cruel. It’s not like carring a wallet, for Hades’ sake. Pregnancy is risky and puts a woman’s body through the wringer as it is; a child’s body is hardly equipped to deal with it. You’re not punishing the perp, you’re punishing the victim. But that’s all the anti-choice side is about–punishing the girls and women.
Sheelzebub | September 2nd, 2008 at 4:09 pm
I really like this post as while it had some definite opinions, it opened up a very important conversation that needs to occur and I agree with what I think you said that if Palin’s nomination opens up a frank discussion on women’s rights, than that is a good thing.
Personally, it came to me as a slap in the face. I am a democrat but more moderate than liberal and apparently against the norm as I started life as a Republican. But it doesn’t matter what my beliefs are. I strongly disagree with Palin’s beliefs but that’s not why I took her nomination as a slap in the face. I have no problem debating people on issues and this great country was founded on strong debate. That’s the point! The reason it upsets me is McCain had some incredibly talented and proven candidates and instead he chose a former beauty queen who governs a state the size of my city. Pick you politics but with all the qualified women in the country, why her?
To SKL, if you don’t want me to make you a carbon copy of every other republican, please do me the same favor.
Stacey | September 2nd, 2008 at 5:12 pm
Sheelzebub, my own views on how 12-year-old incest victims should be handled is not being discussed here. Personally I feel that if a doctor confirmed such a young child would suffer excessive physical harm from carrying the child, then abortion might be warranted, but more importantly, in every case of pregnancy in such a young child, there should be a thorough investigation including DNA testing to determine whether the child was a victim of a crime, and the criminal should be punished just as he would be if caught in the act. Just dispatching the evidence through abortion along with millions of others amounts to sweeping this heinous crime under the rug.
And by the way, the women I know who had children early and/or out-of-wedlock do not consider their children to be “punishments.” Who the heck came up with that usage anyway?
SKL | September 2nd, 2008 at 5:37 pm
I am a feminst and have never been afraid to call myself one. However, I’m aware there’s a younger generation that shies away from the label. The article I’ve linked here is one of the best definitions I’ve read of feminism lately:
http://tomatonation.com/?p=677
rb | September 2nd, 2008 at 5:37 pm
I’ll probably come back to add more to this later, but I think that feminism (and feminists) stand up for human rights and equality.
1.) I support a man’s right to get a vasectomy so I support a woman’s right to get an abortion.
2.) As a feminist, I support women and do not go as far as to directly and blatantly insult their intelligence and say that they should have no choice or simply aren’t smart enough to have control over their own bodies. Sarah Palin is directly horrible for feminism and should not even be deemed as a feminist because as a woman she thinks that women should not be given a choice but should be forced to carry a pregnancy to term despite rape or even incest and that is disgusting and inexcusable. Sarah Palin’s “traditional family values” moves people back in history instead of propelling us forward. Her politics are corrupt and she is one of the most horrible VP picks in American history.
I’m a feminist and because I believe in feminism, I believe in a woman’s right to choose whether or not she wants to have an abortion. I am a feminist because I believe in women.
As for the whole “women deserve better” bs from Feminists for Life…Yeah, I believe women DO deserve better. Women deserve a hell of a lot better than being forced to carry a child they do not want, cannot afford, or is the product of a traumatic and heartbreaking event. Oh, and speaking of women deserving better, take a look at this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iEBQ_Ox7CM
Holly | September 2nd, 2008 at 7:41 pm
I am 25 and I am totally and utterly a feminist. I agree with Veronica…. I am proud to see a strong and thought provoked national conversation emerge from such an anti-woman GOP VP nominee. As a Hilary supporter I would NEVER be so ignorant as to vote for Palin (McCain) just because she is a woman. We must educate all those that might feel that way. I encourage all of you to follow what Veronica has laid forth…. to engage in conversations around what is feminism and what we want in our ideal President.
KE | September 2nd, 2008 at 8:16 pm
[...] was linked to a post on Work It, Mom! via Twitter claiming from it’s soapbox that Sarah Palin is indeed good for feminism. Of [...]
Women DO Deserve Better, Women Deserve CHOICE | Menstrual Poetry | September 2nd, 2008 at 8:19 pm
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/09/02/palin_slashed_funding_to_help.html
According to this, Palin cut funding for teen mothers. I have commented elsewhere that I feel one way the Pro Life movement could reduce abortion is to elect a party that provides support to mothers AFTER the baby is born.
lindsay | September 2nd, 2008 at 9:55 pm
Thanks for all the comments everyone. For more on Feminists for Life, please read Ruth Rosen’s piece at AlterNet:
http://www.alternet.org/election08/96991/
I would never be a feminist if all they ever did was campaign for abortions. Feminism is about options, allowing a woman to make that decision herself, and then supporting that choice. Women of color feminists fight to have children after years of sterilization abuse. That’s my feminism.
Veronica | September 2nd, 2008 at 9:59 pm
I’m with Kim and Florinda. Nice job Veronica taking a controversial issue and making sense of what it’s about - the ability for women and feminists to voice their opinions and be a part of the national stage.
Sara | September 3rd, 2008 at 7:04 am
I don’t get it! Palin should be the feminists hero! The ONLY thing she takes opposites with them on is abortion! She has done and accomplished EVERYTHING the ‘feminist’ platform stands for. She’s succeeded where other women have failed, she’s raised a beautiful family, she takes care of her own. Isn’t that what feminism is about? That’s what I’ve always been told. About going beyond the so-called “glass ceiling”. The only thing anyone is talking about is her stand on abortion. And, again, isn’t this a ‘choice’? Sometimes, it seems as is you just can’t be a feminist if you don’t believe in abortion ‘rights’. Well, I for one, don’t buy it! That’s like saying your not a woman if you’ve had a hysterectomy. Your missing a part. That’s absurd! These organizations constantly amaze me with their hypocrisy. They should be hailing Ms. Palin. Instead, they’re trying to roast her. Well, I for one WILL be voting for Mr. McCain and Ms. Palin.
Peggy | September 3rd, 2008 at 10:07 am
Having grown up in the era when women got abortions on the sly and were lucky if they didn’t die or suffer horribly maiming in the process, I will never understand why anyone would want women to go back to that time. Women will find a way to control their reproduction, whether abortion is legal or illegal. And for those of you who raise the “They can use birth control” argument, I got pregnant twice using birth control. Fortunately, I was young and in a position to give birth to those children. A little later in my life, things were different for me and I was grateful to have the option of legal abortion.
I think I was born a feminist, but I didn’t have a name for it until the ’70s. I’m grateful for the women who made the women’s movement so powerful and now I would never vote for any candidate who has shown in word and deed that women aren’t capable of thinking through situations and making good choices about their own lives. This goes way beyond abortion for me. It also includes making decisions about working or being a stay-at-home mom, which I was for several years. It involves making the decision to get married or not to get married, to buy property or not buy it, to go into a certain profession, to live one’s life as one sees fit.
Feminism is humanism at its best. It means freedom and equality for all people. If younger women think it’s okay to regress to another era, they will suffer the consequences.
Diane | September 3rd, 2008 at 10:55 am
Veronica - I couldn’t agree with you more. I’m glad that McCain nominated a women to get us all talking about women’s rights and feminism. But Sarah Palin is not a candidate that will stand up for women’s issues. She’s staunch conservative from the religious right who knows her feminist talking points.
I gavce my own feminist perspective over at my blog too. http://tinyurl.com/6dw6u7
Thanks!
Robyn
http://www.whosthbossblog.com
robynroark | September 3rd, 2008 at 12:40 pm
When I heard that Sarah Palin was the nominee for vice president, I thought McCain was brilliant and worried a bit about Obama’s chances. Then my brain sparked all kinds of scenarios and positions on the nomination.
Maybe this choice isn’t so good. Maybe Obama should have chosen Hillary. Maybe she will be an advocate for women’s issues. She can definitely speak to the oil crisis. She has a solid family life and is active in the community. She knows the grassroots issues. She’s tough with her NRA stance. Alaska, what are women like from there?
Bottomline, Palin would be good for women and children. Hopefully for the issues that matter to mothers and families, healthcare, jobs, economic development. Woman usually pay attention to the details.
She can also address domestic issues. Foreign policty not so sure, but did Clinton. He never professed to be stron on foreign policy, all though he tried.
Because her daughter is pregnant is not necessarily the result of bad parenting. Tell me you have always used protection in the heat of the moment. On the other hand, putting her daughter through such scrutiny is a bit disheartening. I do know, however, if I was asked to be Vice President, my daughter would tell me to fight for it no matter what. The public can give personal opinion, but this is all relative to individual beliefs and upbringing, education level. What matters is the commitment that has been made within the Palin family to the Palin family and serving our country.
I recently had to turn down being a spokesperson on a political race because I was in the midst of a bogus custody battle. I say bogus because he didn’t really want the kids, he wanted me to give up his child support payments. Campaigns are brutal and time consuming and I simply felt I would have been doing a disservice to the candidate and myself. That was me and my choice.
Palin will have all the support and nurturing that she and her family need at this time. She seem like a strong woman and women should be proud.
A woman has never been given a shot at running the country, maybe this is the missing link our country needs. I personally think that our country is in such straits economically that neither presidential candidate will make a dent for at least four years from now or even then.
I am not saying I support the R’s or the D’s, but do not judge a woman until you have been in her shoes. Look at her as a person who deserves a chance to prove herself. Be proud that she has this opportunity. Just as Obama has this opportunity. Our country is asking for something different and the political machine will not allow them to falter, any more than Clinton or Bush or any other president and vice persident in the past.
People have different thresholds for tolerance, courage and strength. My own mother told me I would fail when I divorced my cheating ex, getting a good paying job after being a stay-at-home mom for 11 years and moving across the country to start a new life alone with my two children.
I have succeeded despite the people closest to me trying to steal my dreams and the dream of a better life for my children. My vision for my new life a has been accomplished in a year’s time. We are blessed beyond belief. Women are more resilient than people give us credit for. Just believe and have faith in all things good. This is what the suffragettes were fighting for…and the feminists…choices!
Nicole | September 3rd, 2008 at 1:08 pm
To Diane and some others,
I hope you can understand why I find it sad that when we’re making a decision that will determine the security of our country, the viability of our economy, and other “larger issues,” there are some people whose votes will be determined based on how easy it will be for individual women to discard unborn babies. I wonder if this political phenomenon exists in any other country. It is so shallow in my opinion.
SKL | September 3rd, 2008 at 1:29 pm
Some more thoughts, and I am no poli sci major so feel free to expose my misstatements. It is only my understanding of a very complicated topic that I have cobbled together while racking my brain for memories of my one American government class I have ever taken and a wiki pedia search. First memory of that American government class is that my prof was HOT! So, my facts may be mistated but here goes:
Roe vs Wade is the case that seems to provide the right to privacy which enables people to get abortions. It was decided in 1973 while a Republican president was in office. (No idea what the deal on abortions was before this time, my memories of Dirty Dancing the movie make me think it was a little scary and ineffective)
THe Republicans are traditionally thought to be more anti abortion than democrats. A republican president could nominate judges to the supreme court who are anti abortion and somehow hear a case that appeals, overturns Roe Vs Wade. (this is where I am foggy - I am not a lawyer either)
Since 1973 - 2008 (35 years), a republican has been president for all but 12 years I think (4 for Carter and 8 for CLinton).
If electing a Republican president is the means to end abortion in America, then why hasn’t it happened yet? Why does Roe vs Wade still stand? Is it possible that the government, republicans even, recognize that no matter how strong their personal beliefs about when life occurs, it is not appropriate to force that belief on a nation of over 300 million people, through legislation that ignores the belief of a great number? Is hoping and praying for legislation that would allow comparison of China and America on women’s rights issues really the best way to combat abortion?
I can totally see why pro choice people would vote republican if they agreed with the Republican stance on every issue except abortion. Despite talking a big game, no Republican president seems to have done anything about it in 23 years.
I have no idea if others cast their vote based on the abortion issue alone. Based on the boost that McCain has gotten with GOP women since the Palin announcement you would think both sides are voting with just one issue in mind. Which is their absolute right. No one says how you have to prioritize issues.
lindsay | September 3rd, 2008 at 2:28 pm
Lindsay,
Roe v. Wade decided that the states can’t place certain limits on abortion, such as an outright ban during the first trimester. It’s been interpreted overbroadly by many, and there have been at least one or two unsuccessful attempts to reverse it.
If Roe v. Wade were reversed, it wouldn’t create a federal law against abortion. It would allow each state to make its own laws (beyond what they already do). The results would vary from state to state. One or two still have old laws on the books that would become effective again. States where popular opinion is very pro-life would probably legislate various abortion bans, such as a ban against all abortions other than in cases of rape or incest, etc. Many states would do nothing because there is no popular wish for a ban on abortion in those states. So basically, if you lived in a state like NY, this wouldn’t affect you at all, but if you lived in a more conservative state, you might have to travel somewhere if you wanted an abortion.
Obama made a comment in his interview about his religious beliefs, explaining why he doesn’t believe in a constitutional ban on gay marriage. He said it’s not been historically the business of the federal government. I agree with him. But the same was true of abortion, prior to Roe v. Wade. I feel the federal government has no business dictating this matter to states one way or the other.
I am staunchly pro-life, and a lawyer who studied RvW and concluded that it created a new right that did not exist under the constitution. I would love to see RvW overturned. However, I don’t vote based on that issue. I have voted for pro-life and neutral and pro-choice candidates, based on other issues. Only if there were no other significant differences between the candidates would their abortion position determine my vote.
SKL | September 3rd, 2008 at 3:26 pm
SKL,
I 100% appreciate your response. I learned more reading that than I have in days, reading other Pro Life sites, and the writing of other Pro Lifers. Thank you. More for me to think about!
lindsay | September 3rd, 2008 at 4:08 pm
SKL- Well, shallow I’m not, having spent a lifetime working, studying, writing, analyzing issues, raising three wonderful children, who are now raising my grandchildren. The issue of reproductive rights isn’t the only one I consider, of course. However, it has been my experience that politicians who trust women–and men–with decisions about their reproduction are also best able to keep our country secure and deal with the issues that face Americans.
Those who support abortion rights also favor a living wage. They favor helping women who have children with child care. In my experience, anti-choice people drop the ball after the woman gives birth.
I also support endiing the bogus war for oil in Iraq and bringing our brave men and women home. They’ve sacrificed enough. As well, I support saving our environment, keeping our water clean, our food supply safe, funding public education adequately (I’m a retired teacher and I have grandkids in the public schools, so I have a stake in this), teaching good science in our schools, keeping the Social Security system out of the hands of Wall Street speculators, and saving polar bears. Most abortion rights supporters agree with me on these issues.
I think it’s strange that Palin has consistently used the word “choice” when she discusses her own daughter’s pregnancy. It’s unlikely that girl had much choice in the matter, and she for sure wouldn’t if her mother could change the law. Palin certainly doesn’t want to give young people any information about avoiding pregnancy except for abstinence. Yes, that works.
From everything I’ve read about Palin, and I don’t get my information on the issues from the boob tube, I don’t think she would be supportive of women at all.
I think she’s a disaster and not because her daughter got pregnant out of wedlock. Her stands on the issues are terrible.
Diane | September 3rd, 2008 at 9:00 pm
Just because she has a vagina does not mean that all women should vote for her. As far as her being good for feminism, that would be no. In my book feminism is not about controlling every aspect of other people’s lives and taking away their choices. Her strong stance against abortion, her wanting to push for more government control on what is taught in schools about sex and science, she wants to eliminate access to family planning and domestic partner benefits. What about any of this screams she is good for feminism? All it shows is that she is power hungry conservative who wants to push her beliefs and views on the rest of us. How in the world is that supportive of women?
Jess | September 4th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
Ditto on not being sure what the earlier commenters were getting from your piece. But it is CRUCIAL thatn women focus on what Palin stands for and not be swayed by the woking-mother-who-seems-to-have-it-all tableau the GOP is presenting.
PunditMom | September 4th, 2008 at 12:57 pm
wow…thanks for ALL the comments, women.
ALrighty…as for the question regarding why guns are a feminist issue, I subscribe to the idea of intersectionality. that means I like to see how feminism & X issue intersect and what that means for women. All my feminist issues intersect at some point. I usually end up spinning myself dizzy over this. Ex - Economic well-being is essential for women so we can have full control over our futures, without it, we may have to “choose” to give our child up for adoption, abort, or live in poverty. If women had full access to safe & affordable child care AND the Congress & states saw going to college as work, then more women would be able to keep unplanned pregnancies and raise their babies without having to decide if their 7yo son is old enough to care for a 20-mo child.
As for ROE…here’s what my lawyer friend says:
Current division:
Pro-Roe:
Stevens 88 years old (Ford appointee)
(edited to correct Stevens age)
Breyer 70 (Clinton appointee)
Ginsburg 75 years old (Clinton appointee)
Middle:
Souter 69 (Bush I appointee) — voted to uphold Roe but OK with 24 hour waiting periods, anti-choice lectures, parental involvement)
Kennedy 72 (Reagan appointee) — voted to uphold Roe but then voted in favor of so-called partial birth abortion ban
Anti-Roe:
Roberts 53 (Bush II appointee)
Alito 58 (Bush II appointee)
Thomas 60 (Bush I appointee)
Scalia 72 (Reagan appointee)
The only reason that Roe still exists is that Bush has not been able to replace enough the pro-choicers, who are the oldest on the court. There is no question that only one will make the difference.
As for the question of abortion being thrown back to the states, NARAL pro-choice America has excellent maps that show you where all the dormant laws live:
http://naral.org/choice-action-center/in_your_state/who-decides/maps-and-charts/
Veronica | September 4th, 2008 at 1:55 pm
I agree with PunditMom! Remember the speech writers wrote the speech to fit the situation. I watched and listened. No doubt she is a good mom, great wife, wonderful daughter, and has made her mark on politics. But you think for one minute that VP Palin wouldn’t be read the riot act for putting her 2 cents in. I feel that she is being used to get what the party wants, as do both parties but….. Oh sure let her get up there reel em in…….atta girl. (and she’s not bad to look at , they even have buttons that say hotest gov in coldest state) But go slow sister because the good ole boys are still in DC. I look for someone that is going to work for us after the dust settles. We have a VP that does what?
kbegnaud | September 4th, 2008 at 2:31 pm
COMMENT DELETED.
We can disagree, but i won’t approve comments that are pure hate. ~ v
Sally Joe | September 4th, 2008 at 8:28 pm
“And by the way, the women I know who had children early and/or out-of-wedlock do not consider their children to be ‘punishments.’ Who the heck came up with that usage anyway?”
That would be your side, insisting that if you have sex, you should have the child.
I, too, have friends who are single mothers. They don’t regard their children as punishments because they had the *choice* to have them and they *chose* to have them. They were not *forced* to have them, and they were not *forced* to carry their pregnancies to term.
And if your views on 12-year-old incest victims aren’t of issue here, why bring them up?
Sheelzebub | September 5th, 2008 at 8:58 am
SKL’s comments are terrific!
One thing to note: jurists at all levels, including those on the Supreme Court, are not supposed to MAKE laws, but rather interpret them. Personal opinions are not supposed to enter into the decision-making process. I held a quasi-judicial position in my state for 12 years and, on several occasions, had to make decisions that I personally disagreed with but that were according to the law.
Also, I’d like to share part of a post from my blog:
This isn’t a political discussion, and yet it is. It’s just not a partisan political discussion.
I’m sorta (for non-Southerners, that’s “sort of”) glad Sarah Palin and Joe Biden are the candidates for vice president. (At least we know the next vice president will have a two-syllable last name that ends with an “n.”)
That’s because I sometimes wonder if elected officials, especially those in the highest offices, experience life like the rest of us do. I wonder if they have to make the tough decisions that the rest of us have to make. Sarah Palin and Joe Biden have some real life experiences.
Just after Joe Biden was first elected to Congress, his wife and daughter were killed in an automobile accident. His sons were injured in the wreck. He experienced tragedy and loss. Then, all of a sudden, he was a single parent. Later, he remarried, so he knows what it’s like to deal with “step” issues. His sons had a step-mom with his remarriage.
Biden was stopped in his bid for the presidency in 1988 because of issues related to plagiarism in a speech.
Sarah Palin has a special needs child, although since the child is just a few months old right now, she hasn’t yet had to deal with the problems to the extent she will have to over the next few decades. She has a pregnant teen-aged daughter, and we’ve learned that the teenager and her boyfriend will marry and keep the baby.
Sarah Palin is a working mom (and, yes, Joe Biden is a working dad, although his children are now grown); she has five children, one of whom is being deployed overseas later this month. Palin’s sister is divorced from someone who threatened violence and abuse against family.
In no way do I rejoice that these two candidates have had personal problems. However, even when we as the general public seem to want our politicians held to extremely high standards, we also want to know they understand the rest of us and the choices we sometimes have to make, don’t we?
Sherry Martschink | September 6th, 2008 at 5:06 am
I can’t believe what I am reading! Some of these comments are so upsetting.
I sincerely hope that everyone here votes for a president and VP based on their stance on the issues…ALL the issues…and what they believe is best for the country.
PLEASE research the candidates, read their websites, find out what they really believe, not just what the TV ads tell us.
Also, if you are not registered to vote, please do so ASAP!
Lastly, don’t forget to vote!
Thank you,
Valerie
A concerned citizen
Valerie | September 8th, 2008 at 3:24 pm
We linked to this in our post “Why Sarah Palin is Bad for American Women” at the CA NOW blog: http://www.canow.org/canoworg/2008/09/why-sarah-palin.html
Elena Perez | September 9th, 2008 at 2:44 pm
SLK:
“I hope you can understand why I find it sad that when we’re making a decision that will determine the security of our country, the viability of our economy, and other “larger issues,” there are some people whose votes will be determined based on how easy it will be for individual women to discard unborn babies.”
Just as there are some whose votes will be determined solely on how far the candidate claims to be willing to go to abridge a woman’s right to control her own body.
But, really, this is beside the point!
Here’s where I stand (for or against) vis a vis McCain/Palin’s policies on the so-called “large” issues you cite above:
security of our country (i.e., engagement in Iraq; potential war with Iran; infringement of individual liberties — well, those liberties that aren’t represented by the gun lobby, anyway) - AGAINST
the viability of our economy (i.e., economic recovery plan) - AGAINST
other “larger issues”…which I take to mean things like
+ Universal Health Care - AGAINST
+ Proposals to slow climate change (even the mere admission that humans have accelerated it, which Sarah Palin denies) - AGAINST
+ Influence of entrenched power, like oil, defense, the NRA, the health insurance lobby, the financial services industry - AGAINST
I could never vote McCain/Palin because I am categorically opposed to the direction they want to take the country (i.e., more of the same). Abortion rights are so far down my list of what needs fixing in this country that I would call them almost a non-issue for me this time.
The more everyone in the chattering class focuses on “issues” of little or no importance (like whether Bristol Palin was “forced” to marry her boyfriend — what makes anyone think that she didn’t plan the pregnancy to get him to marry her? But even if she did, WHY DOES ANYONE CARE? — or whether Sarah Palin is or is not a “good” feminist), the less we focus on things that really matter.
This ticket has nothing to offer the country that I can get behind. Not on national security, not on health security, not on energy or food security. McCain voted Bush >90% of the time. Is that what we want? Another 4 years of the policies that have wrecked our economy, left even more people without access to health care, and compromised our ability to have any credibility on the international stage? For me the answer is no, no and no!
Sorry, Veronica, I *did* enjoy your article, up to the point where you raised the ugly specter of her Feminists for Life credentials. Abortion is too divisive and leads to too many distractions! This is the salient point: “The Pink Elephants give a great break down of things Palin has done for Alaska, but none related to moving women forward towards equality.” Voila.
To really help women decide whether this is a candidate they could or could not vote for, let’s discuss what Sarah Palin has done (or not) and is going to do (or not) for working moms (and women in general) — everything from access to day care to equal pay to paid leave to making sure that every single person in this country has affordable health insurance so if a mom (or dad or anyone, for that matter) gets sick, she and her kids don’t end up massively in debt or losing their home to pay medical bills. As in 1992, “It’s the economy (and the war and health care and climate change and yet again the economy), stupid!”
(Er, not calling *you* stupid!)
MS | September 11th, 2008 at 10:07 am
First, “Republican” and “Feminist” are NOT opposing ideals. Some see the Right to Choose, some see the Right to Life. But moreso, some see the very act of gutting a woman as being a violation. The point is simply that WHY a person makes a choice is what makes them a Feminist…not the choice. I am a FEMINIST and VERY anti-abortion. I think it is a horror against women. Yet I am very much a Feminist.
Two, being a Feminist IS about supporting the growth of women…as equal to a man. It is important to understand that being a Feminist does NOT mean taking away the civil rights of a man. The Violence Against Act violates due process and equal protection…the VERY thing Feminist FIGHT FOR.
THIRD, until women TEACH young girls how to BE powerful, women will continue to not recognize their own strength. Stop blaming a PARTY. Start looking at yourself. You just attacked another woman and call yourself a Feminist. Nice show of support.
Dalia | September 12th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
I haven’t read all the comments but I did read a few.
I think I’m too young to consider myself a “feminist” but I believe in women’s rights. I cannot imagine ever getting an abortion, but I feel better knowing that if I ever did need or want one, I can make that decision for myself. I believe in contraception. I believe in equal pay for equal work. I believe in many “feminist” qualities (if not all of them).
I think that you wrote a very well balanced blog and I jut want to say thank you, and I hope you disregard the negative comments.
lexi | September 12th, 2008 at 10:29 pm
Wow alot of people here seem to belive everything anyone from NOW or NARL tell them to belive.
Sarah Palin is pro-life. So am I.
She belive that if creationism is brought up in a classroom setting by the student a robust debate should be allowed. She has stated that she does not think it needs to be part of the ciruculum and in all her time as mayor or govenor hasn’t pushed for it to be part of the cirriculum.
She asked a librarian what the policy on banning books was after taking over as Majoy. I’m very against censorship and I would have asked the same question. I would want to know what the policy was. I have no way of knowing what her intentions were when she asked the question. However, the librarian who had the question put to her has stated that Sarah Palin never asked to have any books removed.
The only quote I have heard from Sarah Palin about sex education has her supporting education on condom usage. I assume she supports education on other forms of birth control as well. Everyone seems to assume that she must opose birth control because she is pro-life. The two stands are deffinately not necessarily linked.
People do your research. I’m sure you can find legitamite reasons to dislike her if you look hard enough but try to base them on the truth.
For me I’ll be voting for McCain/Palin. I was leanin to Obama until I read his book.
I am excited and energized by a woman who has gotten where she is by sticking to her values and beliefs, by being a strong woman and mother. I look forward to casting my vote in November.
JollyGG | September 16th, 2008 at 5:51 pm
[...] Why Sarah Palin is good for feminism (”Veronica,” WorkItMom.com) [...]
Brand Me Redux » Everything that’s wrong with Sarah Palin | September 26th, 2008 at 2:38 pm
Ok Enough with the Propaganda!
I’m 26, a mother of a 2yr old, a wife, college student and a working girl in a mans world.
I’m am the Epiphany of a feminist!
Palin is the Anti-Feminist!
Womens rights got her to where she is today, but she wants to use those rights to control my uterus. It’s mine, back off.
Abstinence didn’t work in her home, don’t push it into mine. No one controls me or my body! Exit my uterus please, I may want to fill it one day.
Obama has experianced what it’s like to be discriminated against and he’s still strong, like me. I vote for me, not you, not a hypothetic 12 yr old, not for feminism. I vote for me.
Casie Mangus | October 3rd, 2008 at 12:20 pm
We may have thought we wanted a woman on a national political ticket, but the joke has really been on us, hasn’t it? Are you as sick in your stomach as I am at the thought of Sarah Palin as Vice President of the United States ?
Since Palin gave her speech accepting the Republican nomination for the Vice Presidency, Barack Obama’s campaign has raised over $10 million dollars. Some of you may already be supporting the Obama campaign financially; others of you may still be a little honked off over the primaries. None of you, however, can be happy with Palin’s selection, especially on her positions on women’s issues. So, if you feel you can’t support the Obama campaign financially, may I suggest the following fiendishly brilliant alternative?
Make a donation to Planned Parenthood in Sarah Palin’s name. A Planned Parenthood donation is tax deductible, where a political donation isn’t. And here’s the good part: when you make a donation to PP in her name, they’ll send her a card telling her that the donation has been made in her honor. Here’s the link to the Planned Parenthood website:
http://www. plannedparenthood. org/
Go to donate. You’ll need to fill in the address to let PP know where to send the “in Sarah Palin’s honor” card. I suggest you use the address for the McCain campaign headquarters, which is:
McCain for President
1235 S. Clark Street
1st Floor
Arlington , VA 22202
Betty | October 7th, 2008 at 3:55 am
Is she really? While I don’t really know exactly what the term “feminist” really means other than it has to do with “women’s rights” and I’m all for our “rights”. My thoughts are, if Sarah Palin was not a candidate for the Vice-Presidential position, would anyone care about her and anything she thought or did, other than those in Alaska? What about the “abuse of power” is that meaningless, is that what feminists do, abuse power given to them by people who believe in her/them. While a feminist might say that it was/is the right of Palin’s daughter to be sexually active, what about the consequences, its great to have a child (for Palin grandchild), I have 5 of my own, their all grown now, 4 girls, 1 boy, a couple of them were sexually active, I did not push the point of the consequences, and I have witnessed dreams fall to the wayside (for one of my daughters she can never achieve her dream as a volleyball player at the Olympics because it is a young woman’s sport, also, she now has children that occupy all of her time, energy, money, on and on. Even as a feminists, consequences can be both good and bad. Here in the State of Hawaii, a union person was jailed for using funds to build a home, should public funds have been used to build Palin’s home. If you are a feminist, shouldn’t you do everything you can to serve women whose rights have been violated, such as a man doing the same exact job as a woman and get paid more, that we should fight for, also, be sure that you are above reproach. When running for office keep to facts on the economy of your state, county, etc., not to “bash” another candidate, is that what feminists do?
Ekela | October 16th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
[...] Sarah Palin and the mommy wars [...]
Election 2008: What Work It, Moms are talking about - Work It, Mom! Blog - Work It, Mom! | November 3rd, 2008 at 11:02 pm